A (Not So) Brand New Interview

I've been busy finishing up my contributions for the upcoming issue of Redefine, so funny reviews and my nudges to pop culture have been set aside. I found an old site that compiled interviews that I was going to put into a book when Season of Death/Breathless Mahoney went on tour; the idea for the book died, butI wanted to put some of the interviews up on Chasing Coolness. All of the interviews are culled from Halftime, a zine that I started with numerous friends. I stopped doing it to focus on school and the band.

This interview with Brand New's Jesse Lacey took place in June of 2003, just as their sophomore album "Deja Entendu" was breaking. Removing the fact I wrote it, it's a good read. You actually start to feel how bothered he was at the time and tired of "the scene." In a later interview with "Spin," he said that the current emo-craze was not unlike the hair metal explosion of the 80's, rather than the punk/grunge phase of the 90's. So there it is. Jesse Lacey is a prophet.

Prior to the last couple years, all Long Island, NY had to offer the rest of the world was hip-hop’s most non-threatening group, De La Soul and an alcoholic iced tea that shared its namesake. Within the passing year or so, we’ve been treated to Strong Island’s best kept secret: emo. MTV2 and Absolute Punk.net darlings Taking Back Sunday, Coheed and Cambria and Brand New have all come from the shores of the famed LI. But it is only the latter that have thrown a middle finger at the face of commercial emo and punk in their latest release, “Deja Entendu.” (Triple Crown/Razor and Tie)

After releasing the ultra-poppy “Your Favorite Weapon,” Brand New spent much of 2001 and 2002 playing to crowds who frequent Hot Topic and sing along to Good Charlotte and New Found Glory. Now at the height of pop-punk’s return to commercial glory, Brand New have said goodbye to their ties with the punk world as they enter the universe of indie rock.

“Deja’s” rich, and mostly acoustic, sound is derivative of Bright Eyes, Built to Spill and Cursive. Even the poppiest songs on the record have a ring of early Sunny Day. Recently frontman Jesse Lacey sat down with Halftime to discuss the big changes occurring with the band.

In brief, how did the band come about to its current lineup?

Me, Garrett and Brian have known each other for a while. Garrett grew up around the block from me. We met Brian about seven years ago through a friend of a friend. Vin kinda rounded it out about three years ago when we met him. It was really natural. Me, Garrett and Brian had all been in a band together already, we just played together and it kinda grew into what it is.

Deja Entendu sounds different from Your Favorite Weapon. It’s a really big progression when you compare the two. How did the change come about?

It was kinda like a time-lapse thing, where some of songs off of “Your Favorite Weapon” were written when I was 18 or 17, this record I wrote last year and I was 24, so that six-year difference is a big deal. And honestly after we recorded “…Weapon,” a lot of doing that record had to do with getting those songs out of our system.

Stuff that I had written and I knew was good and I knew people needed to hear. After we were done recording it, we were ready to move on. I wouldn’t be surprised if we could have done “Deja Entendu” two or three years ago, really.

Do you ever feel that you’re in danger of pigeon holing yourself by touring with bands like Rufio or other pop-punk bands?

Not that I thought we were, but we are. It’s already to a point where we kinda have to dig ourselves out of a hole a little bit. And there’s pros and cons to it, too, because there’s a lot of great people coming to shows like that and fans of that music and that scene, and they’re our fans. Without them, we really wouldn’t be where we are today, but at the same time, it’s a little bit secluded and it tends to make other people not want to listen to it and not give it a chance.

Now we’re kinda struggling with this tide of all these bands that we’re touring with. Honestly, I don’t think we sound like any of these bands (at press time, Brand New was touring with Senses Fail, Moneen and the Beautiful Mistake). And if we do, then we’re completely deluded, basically.

I know what we have and I know our potential and it’s beyond where we are now. We’re hoping to get there. It’s stupid that anyone would judge you by who you tour with, it’s ridiculous; but at the same time you have to deal with it.

There’s been this huge growth, where last year you might not have had this kind of audience on the west coast, is this something you ever expected?

No. I remember the first time we ever hit the west coast was right here at Graceland with Starting Line and Finch and that was a year and a half ago, two years ago. I was so surprised to see how many people knew who we were, knew the record and right then it had already surpassed everything we thought was going to happen. And now, we’re headlining these shows; there’s 100 or 200 kids left outside. It’s amazing. I’m so glad that we’re able to mean something that many people, I guess.

It’s like it almost doesn’t matter what happens from here. We wanna be the biggest band in the world, but we’re already past the goal that we set for ourselves.

What would you say are the key influences on Deja?

It’s really hard [to describe]. I was talking to my friend John about this because he mentioned to me after he listened to it, that he heard more of our influences more so on this record than he’s ever heard. He mentioned Modest Mouse, Neil Young, Nirvana and definitely he’s not wrong on any of those, but I don’t know where it came from.

That’s such a strange question. I have no idea; I guess they’re right. I was listening to a lot of the Talking Heads almost exclusively in the studio. But Modest Mouse and Built to Spill and lyrically, Elvis Costello, Morrissey, and Robert Smith from the Cure. I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t striving to live up to a standard that they have set.

Do you feel with Deja and records that may follow it, your audience may grow with you? Maybe it’s not out of the ballpark to think that Brand New may tour with Death Cab for Cutie or Pedro the Lion?

No, not at all. I think that’s more of the reality now that we’re going to face more than anything. If I had to tour with another one of these bands…(laughs). That’s what these bands have been doing. I really don’t want to offend someone personally, but it’s just getting so stale to me. We’re partially to blame; I don’t want to not point the finger at us, but everyone could be so much better than what they’re doing right now. It’s so boring, so many of these shows. I feel bad because I don’t think anyone is getting what they deserve.

I was just talking about Nada Surf and they had that hit on MTV in 96 and put out three records since then and no one’s really taken notice of. And they just put out “Let Go” on Barsuk and I heard that record and [thought] this is probably either the first, second or third best record of this year. No one’s put out something like this in so long. It’s just so honest and so good. It’s so good to see a band reinvent themselves like that and not be scared to be like “Hey, we could write songs that are better than anything we’ve ever written before.”

There are so many bands that are unwilling to do that, they just keep putting out the same record over and over again. I can understand if it has something to do with them being totally uncreative or them just wanting to make some money. I can’t blame anyone for wanting to make money.

There’s those bands on TV right now, on TRL and they have a formula – and they’re playing to 22,000 people a night and playing the pop punk that I was playing when I was 19 or 20 and that’s great because more kids are listening to that. Which means that more kids are gonna listen to my band, eventually, because of them. But at the same time, I feel we owe it – and everyone – owes it to their fans to respect them and to know that they’re gonna grow. Those kids who are listening to Rufio are gonna grow, they’re gonna listen to something new in three years, four years. Whatever I was listening to when I was 21, 20, 19, isn’t what I’m listening to now. It’s a constant change and I think the band should change with the fans. Or you’re gonna disappear.

Wow. Do you ever feel because you’re pursuing music as art, as opposed to music as commerce, people might feel that you’re betraying Your Favorite Weapon?

Of course. When we recorded [Deja], we didn’t know what we were doing. It wasn’t a conscious decision to change, or you know, do a 180 from “Your Favorite Weapon”…. It just kinda came out. When we listened to it after it was done, we realized the changes we made and how much we “matured.” Some people are gonna hate us. It was like we knew it right off the bat, some of these kids are just not gonna get it, whether it’s because they’re young or just because they don’t like what we’re doing now.

It’s kinda like a count your losses thing, because you’re taking a risk and you’re hoping that you’re gonna reach more people. That you’re gonna get new fans. You have to lose some to get some. We can’t [cater] to every single person; we’re trying to write songs that everyone will like. We’re trying to write the best songs we can that pleases as many people as possible, while still pleasing ourselves. If some people don’t like them, then there’s nothing we can do about it.

You talk about honesty on this record and in “I Will Play My Game Beneath the Spin Light” you make mention of touring and cutting yourself, your feelings, on stage…

…The line’s about cutting myself open and spilling myself on stage, basically. It was kind of a graphic, physical reference to what I feel like I have to do. Not so much emotionally, but no one really wants to hear about...how do I put this? People want the blood, they want the guts; they want the graphic hurt and pain. They want to know what’s really going on, they want to see everything you tell – or it’s boring.

Unfortunately, or fortunately, the more honest I am or the specific I am about the things that I’m writing about, the better people respond to it. And that’s understood because I feel the same way about the stuff that I listen to. When I listen to Morrissey and he talks about bashing someone’s skull in, but he’s singing it in a way that makes him seem like the victim – which is the most genius thing I can think of. How do you be the killer and come off like the one that got hurt?

People just want to know that someone feels exactly the same way that they do, and whether if it’s they’ve been hurt in the same way or someone’s been just as bad as they have, someone’s done just as much hurting…and just as ashamed as they are. That’s what gets people and that’s the only way I find I could write, otherwise, the songs don’t really mean much to me….

Along with the stylistic changes, I read somewhere that you guys offered the idea of playing some of the Warped Tour dates this year acoustic….

Yeah, that was funny. Computers are an amazing thing. Mention it to two people and next thing you know it shows up in an interview I do the next day.

It was just an idea we had in passing. Just because in some aspects we don’t fit very well on the Warped Tour…. We thought that playing a quieter set and giving something [a little different]. Instead of something that kids jump around to and get dirty to, they could just sit and listen and enjoy.

We talked about the hopes and growth of this band in the next few years, where do you see yourself as a songwriter in the future? You write these brutally honest songs at 24, at 30, how far can you take it?

Wow, that’s a good question. I was watching the Eminem “Driven” on VH-1 and actually I was thinking about that today because he’s taken some of his songs really, really far. Really far, like mentioning Sonny Bono and they way he died and Christopher Reeve and the way he was paralyzed, that’s really touching on some bases that are just untouchable.

But look at Eminem, look at his status, like I said, that’s what people respond to. If you can be as (pauses). I don’t agree with that, that has nothing to do with me or my life or anything, but it goes to show you that there’s something to shock, blood and gore and all that stuff. Saying something that no one else wants to say. I believe in that part; I believe in saying something that no one else wants to say, as long as it’s honest. As long as it’s something that I’m thinking, other people are probably thinking it, but no one wants to admit it. That really appeals to me in a lot of ways because everyone hides behind it. Everyone wants to be the victim. I want to be that, too, but I’m not. That’s the problem, I’m me and I can’t deny the other parts of me. It’s kinda getting old the way that everyone wants to come across like that and write songs about it. Some of the greatest rock songs ever are written about that kind of hurt. Especially the bands that we play with in the scene that we’re in or come from, they’re just watering it down. No one’s saying anything that’s good, or saying anything.

It’s cool to say something that’s already been said if you’re saying it in a new way or in an interesting way but it’s gonna be stale and old. Some of the stuff on our first record and a few instances on our second record, I’m ashamed of a little bit. I could’ve said some things so much better than that, lyrically. I could’ve written something better and blown people off their feet, but instead I took the easy way out of it and rhymed or something stupid like that. I get on myself so much for that, it just annoys the hell out of me.

All I could do is just hope that technically, I become a better writer and the technical side has a lot to do with it. There’s a lot to say about literary technique whether it be rhyming or rhythm or alliteration, I try to incorporate all that high school stuff that you thought you’d never use into it. And it tends to work. If I can combine that with what I’m trying to say or say I what I want to.